HOST: We all know about this new-construction slowdown, and a lot of guys like me are starting to get a little bit more into remodeling again, but has the slowdown affected the remodeling market also?
MIKE: As the national chairman of the Industry of Remodelers, I can tell you that across the country, the remodeling market's down about five- to six-percent. But you have to look at the -- the individual markets to determine whether a specific market is down or not. And the Chicago market--depending on the part of the market you're involved in, it could -- it's doing fairly well.
HOST: Uh, is it -- Is it across the board -- I'm thinking from town-to-town geographically, or is it more set on financial? Like the upper end of remodeling may be doing better than the lower end or do you see parts of the country doing better than the other?
MIKE: To get the broad-based number across the country, they're not separating it by high-end or low-end parts of the market. (HOST: Okay.) They're just taking the entire country as a whole, and it's down about five-, six-percent. But within an individual market, the high-end guys can be doing better or worse and the low-end guys could be doing better or worse. It all depends on the particular market and the type of economy you have within that market.
HOST: Right. Now in remodeling, I always think of, you know, the big kitchen projects, the master-bath projects and stuff like that. But are there other remodeling projects that you see are taking off or is it still staying in those areas of the house?
MIKE: Well, we do -- At the NAHB Remodelers, we do this thing called an RMI, Remodeling Market Index. And in that index, we ask a lot of questions on a quarterly basis to come up with -- with an idea of economically where the market is. And one of the big things out there right now is outdoor living, with uh -- with outdoor kitchens, patios, barbecues -- (HOST: They're -- Yeah -- ) It's becoming very, very hot. As a matter of fact, they're having a very large convention on that at the end of the month that we're going to be visiting for the first time so we can get a feel for what's going on in that market.
HOST: Right -- Cause you -- We -- I think that must be across the country because our area, too, we're seeing a lot of requests for outdoor kitchens and outdoor living and screened-in porches, you know, being added on. So, it's very interesting to see that that's going on across the country now. What -- You know, everyone's got an opinion on the housing market and new construction. Is the remodeling market, the predictions -- Do they have predictions about when you really think it's going to take off again?
MIKE: Yes. There's a prediction out there by the NAHB Economic Department that the remodeling market will start to climb back up again in -- in late O-Eight or early O-Nine.
HOST: Here at the conference, or the builders' show, we have a lot of educational sessions. Are you involved in any of those or do you attend any of those educational sessions?
MIKE: Uh, typically in the last couple of years I have not gone to too many of those educational sessions because of my political involvement with the association, (HOST: Right.) and I just don't have enough time to do it. But that ends tonight. So -- [LAUGHS]
HOST: Yeah, well there's also so much to see and do here sometimes it's hard to get in those educational sessions, but -- uh, what do you -- ? What have you seen here that intrigues you the most here at the builders' show? The new product or new method?
MIKE: Well, to be honest with you, I haven't had a lot of time to go around the show and look at that right now. But we're dealing with an issue that we've spent a lot of time on over the last two years. The EPA's currently gonna be bringing out a new ruling on lead-based paint that will affect our industry. (HOST: That's right.) And that should be out by the end of March, and that could have a dramatic affect on our industry. And uh -- what the EPA's looking to do is totally eliminate lead poisoning in children and lower the blood lead levels. The problem is by taking the professional remodeler out of the equation with the new ruling, we feel in effect, it will end up having more children becoming poisoned because they -- they -- they aren't going to have their projects done in a proper fashion.
HOST: Now are they more concerned with lead-based in the old paints or piping or --
MIKE: No, it's basically all paint -- is the main source. Technically, the ruling falls into place if you disturb more than two square feet of a wall surface that has lead in it. (HOST: Uh-huh.) Then, you fall into the ruling, which is basically anybody that does anything except pull cables and poke a few holes in the walls.
HOST: Right. So then I guess they're saying if you disturb more -- I mean how are they really trying to remove the professional remodeler from that -- ?
MIKE: It basically boils down to a clearance testing. (HOST: Okay.) At the end of a project, we have to meet a certain clearance testing that -- that's equated to that of a lead remediator. (HOST: Right.) And we are not lead-abatement contractors as remodelers. We are not set up to do that, and the insurance companies will not cover us if we do it, and for us to meet those levels -- we're just not -- we're just not supposed to do that.
HOST: Most remodelers or builders -- once we get in towards, I guess, more of a hazardous waste, it's kind of out of our hands. Um --
MIKE: Plus, the other thing is, by doing a clearance testing, we're proving that we're leaving lead in the house. (HOST: Right.) And that puts us up at a level of liability that we really don't want to get involved in. (HOST: Yeah.) And at the first -- the first issuance of this will deal with houses built prior to Sixty that contain lead and have children under six in them.
HOST: Wow. Well, it sounds very interesting. I'll look forward to seeing it when it comes out. Mike, thanks. It's been a pleasure.
MIKE: Scott, thank you very much. [END]
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